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BatMUD Forums > Guilds.archers > Re: Phase 2
OK, now that most of the bugs/syntax issues are worked out, it's time to move
to the next step.
-- the archer recruiter will now hand over a limited selection of "eq" each
boot, so you can test the damage difference between merchant-made bows/arrows
and those you might find on monsters. For now, the eq being handed out is the
equivilent you might find on a 100k to 200k monster (i.e. good but not
amazing). All the stuff is no-save, so don't bother repairing or chesting it,
just ask for more tomorrow. See if the damage difference is a big deal.
-- I now want to hear about any other things the archers' guild needs. This
includes, but is not limited to, more skills, changes to skills, changes to
guild stats, level/skill training requirements, etc. I'm not asking about eq
yet, and I'm not asking about quests yet (the archers guild will have guild
quests, but I will worry about those later).
I'll ask you to think of a few things and post them here so everyone can see
them.
Shinarae Lluminus
to the next step.
-- the archer recruiter will now hand over a limited selection of "eq" each
boot, so you can test the damage difference between merchant-made bows/arrows
and those you might find on monsters. For now, the eq being handed out is the
equivilent you might find on a 100k to 200k monster (i.e. good but not
amazing). All the stuff is no-save, so don't bother repairing or chesting it,
just ask for more tomorrow. See if the damage difference is a big deal.
-- I now want to hear about any other things the archers' guild needs. This
includes, but is not limited to, more skills, changes to skills, changes to
guild stats, level/skill training requirements, etc. I'm not asking about eq
yet, and I'm not asking about quests yet (the archers guild will have guild
quests, but I will worry about those later).
I'll ask you to think of a few things and post them here so everyone can see
them.
Shinarae Lluminus
Shinarae
A r c h w i z a r d
2y, 6d, 1h, 15m, 15s old
Level:
200 [Wizard]
Can we expect to see some more depth in the guild, the sort of things we're
used to seeing in non-nomadic backgrounds? As of right now I'm not entirely
sure how this guild fits into batmud aside from being a backrow tank? I know
there is more to come but as of right now the skills look exactly like what
we've come to expect from a nomadic guild.
used to seeing in non-nomadic backgrounds? As of right now I'm not entirely
sure how this guild fits into batmud aside from being a backrow tank? I know
there is more to come but as of right now the skills look exactly like what
we've come to expect from a nomadic guild.
Quote:
Can we expect to see some more depth in the guild, the sort of things we\'re
used to seeing in non-nomadic backgrounds? As of right now I\'m not entirely
sure how this guild fits into batmud aside from being a backrow tank? I know
there is more to come but as of right now the skills look exactly like what
we\'ve come to expect from a nomadic guild.
used to seeing in non-nomadic backgrounds? As of right now I\'m not entirely
sure how this guild fits into batmud aside from being a backrow tank? I know
there is more to come but as of right now the skills look exactly like what
we\'ve come to expect from a nomadic guild.
caught up to me :-p)
Currently the guild isn\'t even backrow guild, TBH; I haven\'t tried the \'eq\'
weapons (due to being frozen to try to keep a life at times, but I\'m obviously
failing as I read news on the website :p), but as it was (at least with skills
in 70-90 range), the damage simply sucks. And this with 300+ dex (Nuane\'s got
ways more and 100 skills, and even he\'s not comparable to any backrow blaster
as far as I know). So I\'m not wearing even dex gear as tank-archer, just
def/dam and some random dex leftover slots..
Archers are currently ironically at their best in front row; they do more
damage than other nomad tanks, can choose their damagetype, and still get
decent def skills (especially coupled with secondary guild(s) - I imagine
squire-cav-beastmaster-archer is right now hottest def on the block, and it
even deals some damage).
How to change that? I don\'t know; uptune epcost of stuff AND uptune damage,
tune down def skills, make hop back work worse? I haven\'t tried slings, but
difference between bow and x-bow is right now close to zero; bow seems better
dps overall, xbow maybe _slightly_ more damage but both have pretty much same
set of skills etc, which is droll. Stapling/blinding shot are nothing to write
home about, bolt burst too wasteful, and arrow spray hard to use..
Maybe slings\' stunning shot is actually useful, but in general I was
non-impressed with the shots; for me, the play consists just of chaining large
crossbow shot, while my 3 _other_ hands + dam gear actually deal out most of
the damage (xbow did about 30dpr for me if I include failed hop backs; my
other hands+horn maybe 100dpr more (and way more if mob is stunned)).
My play experience WITHOUT using bow was pretty much the same, except I could
impale with polearm and do way more damage per round.. Especially in parties,
using a bow was never worthwhile (but I never got to real def-exp party for
some reason with pure archer..) The difference is probably even greater if you
have race with less limbs than I do.
Tunes I would do (random order):
- multiply epcost/damage by about 1.5x (as it is, I never even hit 300ep mark)
- random duration to skills (dunno if implemented yet, but 10 second delay
always is not too fun imho, in case of lcs+my rapid winching)
- upgrade the bolt burst/arrow spray (as it is, BB destroys 3 bolts, and does
about 30%? more damage, not exactly great deal in my book)
- make hop back work worse in frontrow (to encourage backrow stuff, and to
balance the first tune suggestion)
- maybe add some spice - explicit rep system, guild quests, emotes, stuff..?
- guild shop please
Cheers,
-Daerid
OK, my responses so far:
-- multiply epcost/damage
Not sure how I feel about that. Other archers have said "because we do more
damage with skills than melee, the ep cost is already mich and should go
down". I'm tempted to agree with them at this time. But, I can make a couple
of sling/bow skills that use more eps and do more damage. "Power shot" or
something.
-- random duration to skills
I will add a mild amount of randomness when testing is over. But archery is
precise, and I won't make every skill into iron palm. Think +/-1 round.
-- upgrade bolt burst/arrow spray
The effect of those skills would truly be felt with more powerful missiles
and/or more of them, but I have to agree, the addition ammo cost doesn't seem
quite worth it at this time. I'll see what I can do about it.
-- encourage backrow stuff
Actually, I'm quite happy with the fact that archers seem to be doing ok in
the front row. Archers were never really intended to replace any other form of
blaster -- they're supposed to do more than most tanks with their skills, but
not as much as mages or priests. If they can use their attacks while
maintaining the status quo of "tank in front, casters in back" I'm ok with
that, and I don't want to discourage soloing, either. But I could do a few
things. I could, for example, limit the use of hop back if there's anyone
behind you, with a skill% penalty or just plain autofailure (this would, of
course, not affect solo work at all). Or I could lower the skill effect a bit
overall. But my main thought involves the guild exp costs.
The guild exp costs are high, probably way too high. But "hop back" is turning
out to be the most handy autoskill the guild has. What I could do is lower the
rest of the guild's costs, but leave hop back the same or even raise it. That
would make a much bigger distinction between newbie and highbie archers.
-- add some guild spice
No problem. While "location of weak spots" is the only existing rep system, I
can add more. And I have plans for multiple archer guild quests too.
-- guild shop please
I've already talked with Sprite about an "ammo exchange" and Grizzt is working
on a nice, full guild hall for you which will include at least a basic shop.
Keep the comments coming. More is on the way.
Shinarae Lluminus
-- multiply epcost/damage
Not sure how I feel about that. Other archers have said "because we do more
damage with skills than melee, the ep cost is already mich and should go
down". I'm tempted to agree with them at this time. But, I can make a couple
of sling/bow skills that use more eps and do more damage. "Power shot" or
something.
-- random duration to skills
I will add a mild amount of randomness when testing is over. But archery is
precise, and I won't make every skill into iron palm. Think +/-1 round.
-- upgrade bolt burst/arrow spray
The effect of those skills would truly be felt with more powerful missiles
and/or more of them, but I have to agree, the addition ammo cost doesn't seem
quite worth it at this time. I'll see what I can do about it.
-- encourage backrow stuff
Actually, I'm quite happy with the fact that archers seem to be doing ok in
the front row. Archers were never really intended to replace any other form of
blaster -- they're supposed to do more than most tanks with their skills, but
not as much as mages or priests. If they can use their attacks while
maintaining the status quo of "tank in front, casters in back" I'm ok with
that, and I don't want to discourage soloing, either. But I could do a few
things. I could, for example, limit the use of hop back if there's anyone
behind you, with a skill% penalty or just plain autofailure (this would, of
course, not affect solo work at all). Or I could lower the skill effect a bit
overall. But my main thought involves the guild exp costs.
The guild exp costs are high, probably way too high. But "hop back" is turning
out to be the most handy autoskill the guild has. What I could do is lower the
rest of the guild's costs, but leave hop back the same or even raise it. That
would make a much bigger distinction between newbie and highbie archers.
-- add some guild spice
No problem. While "location of weak spots" is the only existing rep system, I
can add more. And I have plans for multiple archer guild quests too.
-- guild shop please
I've already talked with Sprite about an "ammo exchange" and Grizzt is working
on a nice, full guild hall for you which will include at least a basic shop.
Keep the comments coming. More is on the way.
Shinarae Lluminus
Shinarae
A r c h w i z a r d
2y, 7d, 10h, 27m, 12s old
Level:
200 [Wizard] © 1990-2025 Balanced Alternative Techniques ry. All rights reserved. BatMUD™ is a registered trademark of Balanced Alternative Techniques ry.
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